Author Topic: Do we confront anymore?  (Read 7309 times)

Dennis Nedry

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Re: Taking Ownership
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2007, 11:34:56 am »
We live on a dead end street.  All the neighbors have been there 20 years plus.  We are the only new family on the block.  

We had some run-ins with their kids (they were pissing on our bushes, hanging out on our lake front, disrespecting my child, etc.)  I talked to their parents, and the whole group turned on us.  It is incredibly uncomfortable, and my wife and I want out.  We have a beautiful 1 acre lakefront property, only a few miles from the Loop, but we have to let it go because of the concerted effort to freeze us out.  We can't let our daughter out of our sight.  We paid the big bucks for the house, but the neighbors are a brutish clan that didn't pay much to get in 20 years ago.

My wife and I are now actively looking for a new home and looking in gated communities in the hopes that we can get away from the Lord Of The Flies mentality.

John Masterson

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Re: Taking Ownership
« Reply #16 on: May 29, 2007, 12:01:24 pm »
Jim,

That's awful. I can see the dynamic. They may resent your wealth and position. They're a cohesive group of the same lower "status", and they are banding to abuse the "outsiders" eh?

I feel bad for your situation.

codger

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Re: Taking Ownership
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2007, 12:05:35 pm »
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My wife and I are now actively looking for a new home and looking in gated communities in the hopes that we can get away from the Lord Of The Flies mentality.


That's the ticket. We're in a community of 3+ acre lots and are also on a dead end street. Even with distances and privacy we have a guy who reminds me of Randy Quaid's character in "Lampoon's Christmas Vacation". A real bottom feeder who thinks he's out on a 500 acre farm. His place looks like crap, and he makes no attempt to fit in with the neighbors. He's been here almost ten years. It only takes one.

We don't gang up on him, but we probably should.

SQLplus

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Do we go straight into Code Red now?
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2007, 06:59:20 pm »
>I was behind a guy on a bike, decked out in full racing stretch nylon, furiously pedaling along in front of me at all of 26mph and not moving over to the curb... until I honked at him.<

First of all, 26 mph on a bike is pretty impressive riding - 99.9% of the population couldn't do it to save their lives.  Second, if you had ever ridden a bike on the open road, you would know that the three feet nearest the curb is where all the road debris is - bike tires don't fare well on road trash.  And modern cars are very quiet, so he may not have heard you approaching.

>I called the police last week at 12:30am for the people who had a smoky fire going in one of those backyard portable, round "fireplaces"...the smoke was coming right into our bedroom making my slight asthma tighten up my chest and making my wife cough. The police sent the Fire Department, who came Code Red with full siren and lights...why I don't know... but it got the neighbor's attention!<

Did you talk to the neighbor before calling the cops, or did you go straight to "Code Red"?  I used to live next door to a dickhead who never called to tell me that my dog's barking was bothering him (his four dogs didn't bark, of course...), he just went straight to nasty notes left on my door and nasty phone messages.  No attempt at reasonable dialog.

Well?

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Owww, JM's balls got kicked right in the jimmy...
« Reply #19 on: May 29, 2007, 07:34:46 pm »
I think that interaction with people we don't know or deal with often who do something that conflicts with our well being is quite "lumpy" and asymmetric.

It can be really difficult to figure out what is an appropriate response to some situations.  

The reason JM called the fire department probably has to do with a desire to NOT confront. Many people, even if you ask nicely to stop doing something, will immediately take offense and/or laugh at you and/or will become your sworn enemy. I posit that if you asked a backyard cookout to stop smoking you out, only a minority (20% or less) would respect your request, and the balance would not do anything differently and/or would go very negative.

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BrownsRBack

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Re: Owww, JM's balls got kicked right in the jimmy...
« Reply #20 on: May 29, 2007, 08:38:06 pm »
Actually just yesterday I nearly had my first fist fight in a loooong time.  My sons play whiffle ball in the street.  The "field" backs up to my neighbor's front yard.  We are in Coastal San Diego, and as Renter's have seemingly been pretty accepted in our nabe so this issue had nothing to do with the newcomer status (we have been here almost 2 years).  

Anyway my kids are 10 and 12, and apparently my neighbor said to them "if that ball comes in my garage, I am kicking someone's ass". Now mind you my kids have a reputation with the neighbors for being well-mannered and behaved, so they immediately left, and told me about it.  I sat there for a sec, suddenly became enraged, and took off for the neighbors house fully intending on calling him out for threatening my kids.  I am a peacemaker, not a bully, but I am 6'1, 260, overweight, but strong, and 38.  This guy is overweight, about 5-6 and close to 50. He is always rambling about how tough he is, and teaches his son (also tiny and overweight) to fight at school though he doesn't mess with my kids (wife is 5'10"), but then again my kids don't hang with kids who fight.

Anyway he sees me running over and meets me in the front to say he owes my kids an apology.  Apparently some problem with the wife was happening at the time, and he is an alcoholic (it was 12:00 in the afternoon memorial day), so something set him off.  I escorted him to the back yard where he apologized and explained why he was grumpy and that he really didn't care if they played whiffle ball, especially since his son sometimes joins in.  Today he ran up and apologized again.  

I for one am glad I confronted, because in most cases I NEVER confront, I prefer to keep peace.

codger

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Re: Owww, JM's balls got kicked right in the jimmy...
« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2007, 02:37:16 am »
Sounds like it worked out okay,

I empathize with you. I hate confrontations, and generally avoid shouting matches or fighting. I guess that most of us have a hot button that when pushed, drops our nice guy facade.

In my case, when I go through one of these red-faced sessions, my blood pressure and heart rate rise to alarming levels. While I have normal heart health, but can't help fearing having a heart attack when I go through one of these situations. Adreniline is powerful stuff.

Buried in many of us is a chilvarous white knight, who when offended, can become quite a warrior.

David Cressey

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Off Topic: He who confronts
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2007, 02:48:26 am »
There is an Arabic name that means "he who confronts".  The name is Saddam.


David Cressey

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Re: Do we go straight into Code Red now?
« Reply #23 on: May 30, 2007, 02:53:01 am »
I agree with you SQLplus.  "We" are all reasonable,  well balanced indivudals who respect other's rights and understand their desires.  Meanwhile "they" are all dickheads who leave nast messages, make smoke in the backyard,  ride their bicycles in the road,  and otherwise behave unreasonably.

It's just like all the other issues raised in this forum  (or practically any other forum).  It's the difference between "us" and "them".


John Masterson

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Re: Do we go straight into Code Red now?
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2007, 04:43:48 am »
SQLPlus,

You tangled with the wrong guy this morning  >:        ....       ;)          

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First of all, 26 mph on a bike is pretty impressive riding - 99.9% of the population couldn't do it to save their lives.


And this is relevant to what, exactly?

Yeah, maybe he didn't hear me. So I beeped at him. But I've repeatedly come up behind guys (usually guys, about late 20s to mid thirties) who don't move over. I suspect they want exactly the same rights as cars, even when they cannot match the speed of the road. I've seen lines of cars behind these morons...putting their desire for status behind the needs of 5 or six drivers.

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Did you talk to the neighbor before calling the cops, or did you go straight to "Code Red"?


For the record, I just asked the police dispatcher to have someone talk to him. She decided to call the Fire Dept.

No, G0ddard has it right. I did NOT want him to know who had turned him in.

Just in case he was the type to take repeated guerrilla action against me or my family. He had already had these smoky fires 5 or six times before. That's a marker. The house is a low-cost rental, a shack set way back by the alley, and the guy's got two old junky vehicles out front. And before you say it: no, being poor doesn't make you a criminal or misfit; but criminals and misfits are very often poor...so there is a higher likelihood he could be trouble and have social "issues", I think. See the math/statistics?

The rest of the neighborhood is houses of 400 to 600k. People are friendly and decent.


Dennis Nedry

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Re: Do we go straight into Code Red now?
« Reply #25 on: May 30, 2007, 05:46:48 am »
Good point.  I think most of us don't go to code read right away though.  With neighbors, it's usually a process over time.  A history get built.  There are repeated behaviours that cross over the line.  There are subtle interactions.

With the bikers, they are already at "Code Red".   They are saying "I've got my fruity spandex pants on, I am right in the road in front of your 2000 pound car, and I'm going to force you to go around me.  F.U., and if you say anything about you, I'm either going to flip you off or try to provoke a confrontaton".   There is not time to say "Please Mr. Bike, if I go around you, it will put me into oncoming traffic.  If I try to pass too close to you, you might get hit, and then we'll all be in a world of sh!t."

David Randolph

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In Texas, bicycles have the full right to the road!
« Reply #26 on: May 30, 2007, 08:40:01 am »

John Masterson

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Do you think that's reasonable?
« Reply #27 on: May 30, 2007, 08:54:02 am »
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In Texas, bicycles have the full right to the road!


Do you think that's a reasonable thing?

The Gorn

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Notes on Bicycling and Right of Way
« Reply #28 on: May 30, 2007, 09:01:38 am »
I have ridden a bike semi-seriously at least for over thirty years.

The vehicular codes in most areas mandate that a slow-moving vehicle that cannot reach the speed limit (typically a tractor or farm equipment, but in this context a bicycle) must pull over and let the faster vehicles overtake. In Ohio there is a number of blocked vehicles in back that should trigger the slow front vehicle to yield to everyone. (I think it's some number like 3 or 5 and it is a question that Ohio used on their driver's license tests years ago.)

The problem with bicycling is that as noted, there is lots of crap along the shoulder and the gutter in most streets, as well as things like sewer gratings that would drop a bike wheel. The point being that moving over to allow others to pass is a *highly* hazardous maneuver that could cause a fall, perhaps into the traffic lane. So moving over is impractical.

Then many motorists get impatient with bikers who ride dead in the center of the lane and block them from squeezing by. You tend to see highly experienced cyclists and club riders doing this. The newbies will try to "be nice" and allow everyone to pass. Well, drivers themselves being idiots and part of the slobbering proletariat, allowing drivers to squeeze by you exposes you to great risk of being clobbered by things such as outrigger right hand mirrors, etc. as well as poor judgement of some drivers who may misjudge the distance.

So most experienced riders will force the whole issue by not allowing anyone to pass in their lane by occupying the entire lane. This will force anyone who wishes to pass them to either find a whole other lane to pass, or to hit them from behind. The latter is unlikely when there are witnesses around.

Basically - standing your ground in the lane as a bicyclist is a matter of personal survival. It's not ego so much as it is poor design of most streets for the needs of cyclists.
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John Masterson

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Re: Notes on Bicycling and Right of Way
« Reply #29 on: May 30, 2007, 09:09:22 am »
G0ddard,

The whole argument you posit rests on there actually being life-threatening crap along the side of the lane.

When there is no such material, bikes should do the mature, reasonable thing and move over to let the line of cars pass.

And, would your argument hold for bikers who want to go 12 mph in a 30 mph zone? ...say, experienced bike club members who just want to rest for a few miles?